1 Topic by Rascal (edited by Rascal 09/23/2013 12:05:47 pm)

  • Registered: 09/19/2013
  • Posts: 11

Topic: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

I am new to Front Accounting.

I have been in the process of evaluating MySQL ERP accounting packages for our small start-up business.

I have looked at Dolibarr, WebERP and Phreebooks so far. aDampiere, OpenBravo, OpenERP/Tryton are too big for us.

I can't use Dolibarr as the Sales Tax reporting is insufficiently detailed (and not double-entry). I have had a good look at Phreebooks and in general like it, although the community seems pretty thin. I prefer the GUI of Front Accounting over that of WebERP.

So now to my question.

How is Front Accounting better than PhreeBooks (putting to one side the community issue)?

  • From: Singapore, India, Chennai
  • Registered: 05/02/2009
  • Posts: 6,160

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

Old Comparision 2008

Active Comparision

Multi Accounting Web Software comparision

apmuthu's Website

3 Reply by Rascal (edited by Rascal 09/26/2013 09:51:09 pm)

  • Registered: 09/19/2013
  • Posts: 11

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

@apmuthu
Thank you for your quick response.


I have had a look at the three pages that you have pointed me to and my thoughts are as follows:

1) Old Comparision 2008 - I have previously come across this and there is no real comparison of features with FA.

2) Active Comparision - Really, really poor. Most of the info on PB is totally inaccurate and ... is FA only available as an SaaS solution ??? I think not.

3) Multi Accounting Web Software comparision - very cursory marketing blurb. No comps. SEO fodder IMHO.

Here is a fourth:
http://wiki.xtronics.com/index.php/Linux_accounting   ...   (he is pro-PB, but AFAIK not using it)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok, so I will start with what I know (bearing in mind I am not too famililar with FA. I know PB much better). I am focussing on DIFFERENCES (I have 'bent' this rule for MULTI-CURRENCY as it can be SO important to anyone importing/exporting):

+ves to PhreeBooks Accounting:
- Sourceforge:  'Score'= 4.6,  490 weekly downloads
- the default transaction view is a 'one page layout'   ...    one transaction = 1 line (easy, informational view)
- OpenCart ($20) and ZenCart (FOC) connectors  ...   these are FULL integrations, not just order download. PB 'controls' the cart & listings.
- easy to convert a SO to a PO - 'one click'
- has a 'drop ship' option in Order Entry screen   ... this means that the name/address isn't auto added to the list of 'branches' but still retained in d/base. This also means that ones list of 'customers' doesn't become over-long and unmanageable (if set-up correctly)
- a number of full integrations with couriers and payment gateways   ...   USPS, Fedex, Authorise.net, FirstData, Elevon, Linkpoint, Paypal
- moved away from WebERP (roots) layout totally and adopted a more ZenCart layout (GUI)
- faster order entry (am I right)?
- led by one man (primary dev = Dave Premo) with a vision (perhaps a +ve and a -ve)
- one page entry for BOTH new customer details AND order details (i.e. a 1-step process and not a 2-step process)
- PB feels 'slicker', more modern looking (is this the JavaScript?)
- MULTI-CURRENCY =  limited. Currency set at SO/PO level. Can issue invoices/PO's in MC but cannot accept/make payments in anything but 'home' currency. This effectively means that any foreign currency bank account setup in GL tracks the balance in your 'base' currency.

+ves to Front Accounting:
- Sourceforge:  'Score'= 4.4,  550 weekly downloads
- more vibrant community and I assume more active deployments
- nice (powerfiul) P&L and Balance Sheet visibility options
- nicer looking reports
- commercial interests providing and supporting commercial modules
- genuinely 'Open Source' in spirit
- ability to have categories in inventory and reports e.g. Ford Spares / Chrysler Spares / Fiat Spares etc etc
- Wiki
- multi-warehouse/branch functionality more mature
- 20-30+ actively maintained extensions (PB has many excellent extensions/modules also, but few maintained by the wider community)
- FA feels 'faster' to me
- MULTI-CURRENCY = Currency set at Customer/Vendor level. Apparently FA can maintain multiple Foreign Currency Bank Accounts.
- Consolidated accounts - correct?
-??

... in all honesty I think that I currently prefer PB,  BUT I confess relative ignorance about the features of FA.

Can you add to the above list?     (these are 'stand-out' features that a user will really notice).

  • elax
  • Senior Member
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  • From: UK
  • Registered: 05/17/2011
  • Posts: 326

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

It seems your already made your choice, moreover I guess you realized that posting your question on a FA forum, people will probably like FA (or hate it but are stuck with it) and don't know much about PB, so there are not necessarily the best person to ask.

Personnaly I choosed FA because I needed something
- OpenSource so I can modify it when something is missing
- Multicurrency
- Stock management.
- It also is  super straight forward to use, I think at the time I chose iti, t was the only one I could grasp and use  in seconds. (My memory might be lying).

Now, I'm still using it because I'm stuck with it, but mainly because of some extensions
I wrote for it (which I don't want to rewrite if I migrate to another system).

Now some comment on your DIFF

Rascal wrote:

+ves to PhreeBooks
- the default transaction view is a 'one page layout'   ...    one transaction = 1 line (easy, informational view)

Not sure I understand

- OpenCart ($20) and ZenCart (FOC) connectors  ...   these are FULL integrations, not just order download. PB 'controls' the cart & listings.

I understand why it's appealing, however I did my own integration between FA and DrupalCommerce and I choose to NOT have a full integration between both because I want to be able to decouple them sometimes. Example An item might not be available neither in order but I don't wont to show it as sold out for different reason (
- it's in fact in order but I haven't had the time to enter the PO,
- I can create one from another one,
  - the stock level in FA is wrong saying it's sold out, but I know I have some left but don't have the time
to do a stock check etc ...
- easy to convert a SO to a PO - 'one click'
With my FA module 'texcart' is 4 clicks

- faster order entry (am I right)?

Totally disagree,  my FA module 'textcart' is the fastest way to enter an order (especially if you can touchtype).

- led by one man (primary dev = Dave Premo) with a vision (perhaps a +ve and a -ve)

Not very different from FA
-

+ves to Front Accounting
- more vibrant community and I assume more active deployments

Don't assume anything ;-) It's active but their are not many people working on it (they are really helpful and reactif though).

- nice (powerfiul) P&L and Balance Sheet visibility options

Doesn't PB have that ? Don't use it then ;-)

- nicer looking reports

I wouldn't say they look nice, but they exists.

- commercial interests providing and supporting commercial modules
???
- genuinely 'Open Source' in spirit
- ability to have categories in inventory and reports e.g. Ford Spares / Chrysler Spares / Fiat Spares etc etc

To be fair, I don't use Category in FA ... because I have thousands of items and the category system is not good enough. I use regexp at the moment. I'm planning to do this winter a Tag system.


You seem to know PB well have you already use ? If so does it has something missing so you are trying to find something else?
I couldn't recommend you FA or PB because I don't know what PB does but I know what FA doesn't but I also know its foundation are alright and I could implement myself what I miss.
Everybody have different needs to I guess the best for you is write a couple of standard scenario (stuff you do every day, and stuff you know that you definitely need) and see in both system how it works.


/Elax

  • Registered: 06/10/2010
  • Posts: 5

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

Hi,
I did a comparison long time ago but remember 1 difference that could be important: FA is multistock and FB was single stock 3 years ago.
Hope this helps.
Mariusz

6 Reply by Rascal (edited by Rascal 09/20/2013 09:21:51 pm)

  • Registered: 09/19/2013
  • Posts: 11

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

@Elax
Thank you for taking my query seriously and taking the time to contribute such a comprehensive reply.

I am, as I mentioned, much more familiar with PB due to having installed it and tested it extensively for a number of months. Of course, I am now wondering whether I am capable of looking at FA objectively as my frame of reference is so firmly set in PB.

One of your final comments is very astute -  "something missing ...  trying to find something". I am bothered by the lack of a strong community.

My interest in FA is genuine, however, technically I have liked PB, I don't deny it. I was also wow'ed by some of the features of Dolibarr - not least by it's clever 'Foundation' structure.

You mention extensions/modules - textcart and regexp. Is there a list of current extensions/modules somewhere?

Thank you for you advice - it is good advice.
edit - I meant to ask you, how is your planned "tag system" going to work?



@mkozielski
Do you perhaps mean 'warehouses' that carry the stock.
You are right, I remember now that this is a strength of FA and has only recently been added to PB.
I will add this to my list above. Thank you.



@swheeler
Thank you for your considered response.

First off, the easy bit. Sourceforge ENTERPRISE - 7th March2013 - "SourceForge is pleased to announce our new Enterprise Directory – a sub-section of our site focused specifically on Enterprise projects. These are the projects that are geared specifically for use within a company. This might include areas such as project management, office suites, or customer relationship management (CRM) software. "
So, one has to apply to communityteam@sourceforge.net and convince them that your project is Enterprise ready.
What EXACTLY the requirements are, I couldn't find.

There is no doubt that FA has a larger and more active community and the FA project is better known. Is this because it is older or because it is more closely related to WebERP, or 'better' or more easily modified? I don't know.

You mention your "20+ integrations" - is there a list somewhere of FA integrations?

Thank you for your response.

  • Registered: 09/19/2013
  • Posts: 11

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

@Elax
I realise that I didn't cover a query of yours in my response above.


Rascal wrote:
    +ves to PhreeBooks
    - the default transaction view is a 'one page layout'   ...    one transaction = 1 line (easy, informational view)
Elax wrote:
     Not sure I understand
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am referring to the way that PB, for example,  displays all Invoiced orders on one page. It also applies to Sales Orders and Purchase Orders.  In fact it is THE display method throught PB.

Anybody interested should follow this path:
http://www.phreebooks.com/pb-demo (demo, demouser)
CUSTOMERS > Sales/Invoice Manager, or Sales Order Manager, or Customer Manager   ...   the layout is the same, and
VENDORS > Vendor Manager, or Purchase Order Manager, or Purchase/Receive Inventory Manager    ...   etc etc

  • Registered: 06/10/2010
  • Posts: 5

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

Rascal,
the transaction view in PB is very similar to the one in FA.
http://demo.frontaccounting.eu/sales/inquiry/customer_inquiry.php? (demouser, password)

  • elax
  • Senior Member
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  • Registered: 05/17/2011
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Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

Rascal wrote:

@Elax

One of your final comments is very astute -  "something missing ...  trying to find something". I am bothered by the lack of a strong community.

Right, if you are already bothered by it even before having starting using it in production, that probably answer your question about using PB or not ...

You probably know PB too well to see new system are they but instead compare them to PB and maybe you should try to forget PB and evaluate alternative with new eyes (and take the time to play with it, don't try the demo, install it) (I know it's hard , I have the same problem with FA).

About FA  extensions, they are all downloadable  and installable from FA itself : Setup -> Instal/Activate Extension.
We probably ought to have a list in the Wiki but I don't know if it's done and up to date.

Now, I think it's probably the same with every open source project, you are at the mercy of the community. So if you are a (good) developer you are ok because you know that worth come to  the worth you can still fix a bug or extend it yourself, if you are not ,you'll have to take the software as is, .i.e if something doesn't exists but you need it, don't expect that the community will come and help you. The community (me the first) do only stuff it wants to do: because it needs it or because its fun to do.
They you can expect the community to come up time to time with goodies (that happened a couple of time  since I'm using FA).
Apparently you can also pay people to extend FA, but I never tried this approach ...

/Elax

10 Reply by apmuthu (edited by apmuthu 09/23/2013 07:26:43 am)

  • From: Singapore, India, Chennai
  • Registered: 05/02/2009
  • Posts: 6,160

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

https://frontaccounting.com/fawiki/index.php?n=Main.Usage

https://frontaccounting.com/fawiki/index.php?n=Main.ExtensionList

https://github.com/apmuthu/frontaccounting/tree/master/extensions

Joe, will need to clarify on the FA comment in:
http://wiki.xtronics.com/index.php/Linux_accounting

FrontAccounting

weberp fork via openaccounting LAMP GPL - Same kind of usability problems - If you go to enter a sales order, and you happen to have a new customer, there isn't even a navigation button to take the detour. Source forge rank = 356

apmuthu's Website

11 Reply by Rascal (edited by Rascal 09/23/2013 09:51:51 am)

  • Registered: 09/19/2013
  • Posts: 11

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

@swheeler
Which Shopping Cart is favoured as an order entry front-end?
Is this to achieve an easy path for SO -> PO? or
To enter customer details at same time as order details? or
Drop-ship functionality?

@mkozielski
Thank you for pointing me to that page - how could I have missed that. IMHO I feel that the equiv PB page is 'slicker'. However FA 'feels' faster.
Perhaps I did see it in the demo, but am beginning to suffer ERP exhaustion!

@elax
I think that you are right - I feel another install coming on ( is there a pill for this? smile)

@apmuthu
Excellent links - thank you.
I am particularly impressed by the fact that of the 20-30 extensions in the GitHub Repo, all have received some love in the last 6 months.

RE: xtronics - I think that he does have a point, although his summary was written around 2008/9. Is it still the case that a customer has to be created BEFORE (as opposed to 'at the same time' as) an order can be entered against them - and it not being a quick task?

12 Reply by Rascal (edited by Rascal 09/23/2013 01:01:39 pm)

  • Registered: 09/19/2013
  • Posts: 11

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

Do you have any idea how many instances of Front Accounting are being used in production (used in business)?
Even a rough estimate would be interesting.

  • Registered: 09/19/2013
  • Posts: 11

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

Can Front Accounting receive payments in currencies other than the 'base' (or 'home') currency?

The forum posts (admittedly posted some years ago) seem to suggest that, although a payment can be accepted and booked in a foreign currency (set at Customer/Vendor level), it is automatically changed and stored in the 'base' currency.

This suggests that it isn't possible to maintain any foreign currency bank accounts in FA - is that true?

  • Registered: 12/25/2007
  • Posts: 2,448

Re: Phreebooks or Front Accounting

Sure. You can have as many currency bank accounts as you wish, and FA registers all payments/deposits in bank currency, but GL postings are always done in home currency.
In fact in one payment transaction even three currencies can be involved: home currency for GL postings, bank currency for bank transaction and supplier/customer clearing currency used in AR/AP.

Janusz