3) To be able to assign tax rate to each GL account (just like items). This way you can stop user wrongly entering VAT (tax) to non-VAT supplies.

With my experience on MS Dynamics NAV for 11 years, I think these functionalities will make Frontaccounting a very robust and user-friendly system.

Deven

Can't this be solved with making an item category  for each GL account which you want to monitor and an item for each GL account you want tax calculation?
I am new here and I made a Belgian Legal account three for FA  but to solve the Belgian and EU VAT problem I assigned the GL accounts I need for VAT declaration to an item category. EU, non EU and some other totals I need for VAT declaration I have assigned to the suppliers. I hope it will work, otherwise I have had a lot of work for nothing. I think I finally get some feeling of how this ERP system works. It should be after more then a week every day's work and study.

@demille
I understand your objections regarding supplier invoice posting, but you are at least partially wrong, and probably it is effect of misunderstanding of FA Direct Invoice functionality.

So, Direct Invoice is just Supplier Invoice, GRN and PO made in one step. The additional cost GL lines available in Supplier Invoice form (and absent in Direct Invoice), are for special use and in most cases just sparse. Therefore _all_ journal entry postings generated by Supplier Invoice (without GL lines used) are the same as those generated when invoice is entered via direct Invoice page.

I agree it is sometimes useful to have editable tax entries on Supplier Invoice. When FA is properly configured taxes should be properly calculated, and there should be no  difference between real invoice and calculated VAT. The only reason I can see for this is small rounding errors which can be different in your supplier's invoicing soft.

Currently those differences are not supported directly in supplier invoice form in FA, but you can fix this by separated journal entry.

Again, I agree whether this is legally acceptable depends on local law. I can only say we are working on improvements in code which will make both EU intracommunity trade and above situation better supported in FA. Unfortunatelly this will not be available before next major release,a s additional databse changes are needed for this.

Janusz

Thank you for the explanation, it helped me a lot. If everybody will use FA in the future we would not have a discussion about editable tax entry possibility. But for the moment it would be ideal to have a TAX field that is normally calculated automatically but which can be erased and changed to the amount we want it to be. This way we do not have to make an other entry line to make things Legal and saving a lot of work.
Thank You

@demille
I understand your objections regarding supplier invoice posting, but you are at least partially wrong, and probably it is effect of misunderstanding of FA Direct Invoice functionality.

So, Direct Invoice is just Supplier Invoice, GRN and PO made in one step. The additional cost GL lines available in Supplier Invoice form (and absent in Direct Invoice), are for special use and in most cases just sparse. Therefore _all_ journal entry postings generated by Supplier Invoice (without GL lines used) are the same as those generated when invoice is entered via direct Invoice page.

I agree it is sometimes useful to have editable tax entries on Supplier Invoice. When FA is properly configured taxes should be properly calculated, and there should be no  difference between real invoice and calculated VAT. The only reason I can see for this is small rounding errors which can be different in your supplier's invoicing soft.

Currently those differences are not supported directly in supplier invoice form in FA, but you can fix this by separated journal entry.

Again, I agree whether this is legally acceptable depends on local law. I can only say we are working on improvements in code which will make both EU intracommunity trade and above situation better supported in FA. Unfortunatelly this will not be available before next major release,a s additional databse changes are needed for this.

Janusz

[RANT]:
Non Accountants and Non Programmers must be able manage FA without having to bother with Government - businesses need simple acounting info / capability for day to day operations. Most countries have begun to question the need for Statutory Audit - Self Audit is being encouraged. In the aftermath of Enron / Arthur Anderson / and other major corporations / audit firms / banks fudging accounts, Governments too will soon have automatic billing systems in their countries from which their VATs will be auto-calculated instead of summary submissions each month/quarter/year! There seems to be little trusted data on countries printing / creating money and providing huge windfalls to select individuals of choice - insurance, subsidies, rights.

{NICE]
If you do not sell in currencies (debt denominator) issued by governments - you do not need to pay tax! Corollary - no one pays any taxes for using FA! No one's paying Joe/Janusz any monies for coding and preserving the FA source! Yet FA users will look after you (tax free) when you visit their countries.....People like them are the real assets worth preserving.

Ok, why do you prefer to entry general expenses via Supplier Invoice, instead of generic Direct Invoice form? Can you point out any cost type which cannot be entered here, and use of Supplier Invoice form is just necessary?
In my FA setup I use everyday I have just defined a couple of additional items like 'Electric energy', 'Communication services' and generic editable 'Other services' item, all with item type set to 'Service'. Using them with supplier Direct Invoice makes me free from any tax calculations, all is posted properly without manual calculations.

Janusz

A question to add is: what is legal? In Belgium the journal has to show all bookings made for that invoice especially VAT. VAT must be linked to the invoice ( supplier) and to the GL account where the amounts are booked. So, the most logic way is to book an invoice received via Supplier invoice. Editable tax fields are necessary for entering suppliers invoices because only VAT that is printed on the invoice may be declared and not the VAT the program may calculate. When VAT registration comes to check my books they only use the journals and invoices as legal documents. Direct invoicing from supplies can be easy but is it legal?

Joe

The Gl Items in supplier invoice is an extreme fine possibility to enter supplier invoice for phone bills, maintenance, various cost scenarious. Especielly if we use quick entries for this.

I see no way of entering these kind of cost elsewhere.

If we remove this, I guess we loose many users.

Joe

I'm not sure what you mean here. Could you explain me the problem?

Janusz

Yes it can be done by creating service item for any GL account but than option to post GL item expenses in "Supplier Invoice" doesn't make sense. Another issue is if you have categories GL ledger format then using service item is not possible. Please have a look at my COA.

Deven

Janusz

As I said before, I have thoroughly tested FA and I think I know each and every module and the working of it. I know that you can assign tax group to each and every item. This is the correct way to set up taxes on the system. I am not at all taking about items and “Purchase Order Entry” & “Direct Invoice”. These parts of purchase module are fine. I am discussing about GL account (posting general expenses invoices). All I am saying is that just like item is assigned a tax group/tax code, all GL account should have tax rate assigned. If you read my previous post again, I have not mentioned Items or purchase order entries as I know it calculates tax/VAT automatically depending on assigned tax group. The general expenses are posted on “Supplier Invoices” this is where my previous comment was related to. Please test me COA I have email. This will make things clear.

Deven

On current FA supplier invoice form there is no auto calculation of tax.

There is some fundamental misunderstanding here. Every defined item has assigned Item tax group, which determines tax type and rate.  When item is included in invoice respective taxes are calculated. This works the same both in sales and purchase side.
Please read carefully Tax Configuration wiki topic.
Janusz

I think you misinterpreted my comment. An invoice from supplier SHOULD NEVER be posted via a journal. You have to use purchase module i.e. Supplier Invoices to post expense invoices on any accounting system. General Journals are only used to reallocate costs from one department to another or accruals/prepayments or nominal adjustments. Firstly I feel that when posting expense invoices via Supplier Invoices, we should have auto calculation of tax for each line value or total taxable amount on the invoice (Just like purchase order entry form). Now tax rate assignment to each GL Account (which I suggested in my first comment) is useful for calculating tax on a purchase invoice. For example, a supplier has supplied me few items of which some are VATable @ 20% and some are Non-Vatable. On current FA supplier invoice form there is no auto calculation of tax. You can enter VAT amount either by creating new line with VAT GL account (not advisable as you don't want users to enter amounts in VAT accounts) or do a quick entry which enters tax amount for you based on the amount you put in the left text box. The user has to manually calculate total VATable amount to do the correct taxing and exclude non-vatable amount. Less user intervention/calculations in terms of taxes are highly recommend and should be auto-calculated be the system.

My suggestion is if you have tax rate assigned to each GL Account, then at the invoice level you can write a short code which calculates totals for each different tax rate for the GL accounts on the invoice and then auto insert tax line/s as per the tax rate of the GL account. Or for each GL account line VAT is auto calculated based on the tax rate of the GL account. i.e. On a supplier invoice I have 2 different GL account line (stationery & uniform which are VATable @ 20%) and 1 GL account line (refreshments – Tea which is non-vatable). The Invoice form then total of stationery & uniform line and generates a line with 20% tax. There is no tax line generated for non-vatable amount and is excluded for taxable/VATable purchases.

I think to do this you will have to create a 2 new columns in chart_master table (tax/vat rate & tax/vat amount) and a small script in supplier_invoice.php.

I hope it’s not too demanding.

Please let know contribution box email.

Many thanks

This is the best discussion I have ever seen on an open source accounting package on the topic of UK VAT.

As a Sage user since 1986 I would love to have an accounting solution to run on linux but have yet to even find one I feel worth trying, until now !

I feel a UK setup script would be a fantastic development for FA.

Thanks for giving me hope.

Dave